Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

What is it like to live in Luxor? Share your experiences of Luxor's culture.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Brian Yare » Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:21 pm

Eurydice wrote:Last winter I was typing my letter in the Inet cafe on the famous seedy street (West Bank)
Which famous seedy street is that? I don't think that I recognise it!



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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by carrie » Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:54 pm

Lets be honest, most tourists save up for twelve months to afford a two weeks holiday, you come here with a certain amount to spend and are not careful with your money. If you go home and have spent up, so what. I remember times coming here on holiday and thinking on the last day that I still had so much left what could I spend it on. When Egyptians see tourists splashing all this money around they think that we live like that every week of the year however many times you try to explain that life is not all a bed of roses in the UK or elsewhere they find it hard to believe. Especially when they hear what salaries are in the UK they convert it to Egyptian and think we are all millionaires.
On the whole the majority of Europeans even though they may not be on top wages still have a better standard of living than the average Egyptian.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Miss scarlett » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:05 pm

Just wondered about the cost of paint. Just intrigued really. I think I would have done the same as Dusak, more fulfilling knowing you haven't been fleeced for that paint brush.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Dusak » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:40 pm

Miss scarlett wrote:Just wondered about the cost of paint. Just intrigued really. I think I would have done the same as Dusak, more fulfilling knowing you haven't been fleeced for that paint brush.
Cost of white emulsion. Cheap ten ltr 75Le ish. Top quality same size [one coat] 110LE. Top quality colour mixed to you choice 10 ltr, 210- 360Le dependent how much colour stain is needed to obtain required shade which is available in mat or 'shiny' finish.. The deeper the colour needed, the higher the price. You can buy the cheap white and then purchase the 3Le colour add ins to mix your own shades but you need to know what colours to add together to achieve desired shade which you can get off the internet. These home mixed colours are OK for internal walls, but soon loose their shades outside due to the sun. The more expensive ones retain their colour. Gloss paint is sold by the ltr or kilo. The cheapest is about 10Le a ltr. the colour mixed is 40Le per ltr. You can buy three ltr. tins for 120-180Le, again dependent on the shade. These shades can only be bought from the shops that have the computerized colour mixing facility.

About the best brushes I've come across have green handles and are stamper ''the Swedish brush co. They are about 10Le for a 1.5''-3'' but not many places sell them. In winter you do need to use thinners with the gloss as it soon begins to run thick off the brush. Also to soak the brushes in between jobs but use a glass jar for this as some of the thinners eat through thin plastic. This costs 3Le for a beer bottle sized amount. For emulsion you can buy the simulated lambs wool rollers for about 6-10Le which do many times if rinsed out after use but I have yet to find any seller of the roller trays. I use a square plant pot drip try which is perfect for the job. The roller itself costs about 10-15Le.

If you need to fill hairline cracks or quite wide or deep ones, there is a lightweight filler sold here called krack filler made by Scib paints which is sold at the hardware shop at the beginning of Hospital street. I pay 20Le per pre mixed tub but many try and charge you between 30-40Le. This same very good filler was £10 per tub in the UK before I came to live here. Best filler you can buy. Instructions in English.
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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Miss scarlett » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:57 pm

I found that really interesting! I really did. Was surprised at the cost of the colour mixed top quality paint, about the same as in the UK really, and I would of thought too expensive for alot of the Egyptians. Or they have to save for a while to afford it.

Thanks Dusak, always interested in the price of everyday things out there.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Glyphdoctor » Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:29 pm

carrie wrote:When Egyptians see tourists splashing all this money around they think that we live like that every week of the year however many times you try to explain that life is not all a bed of roses in the UK or elsewhere they find it hard to believe. .
Why should they believe really? Leave aside your expenses, you spend more money on your airfare alone than some of them have to live off of for an entire year. Do you realize that to be in the top 1% of earners in Egypt you have to only make 80,000LE a year? That 99% of people make less than that? That's still far below the poverty line in your own country.

If you can take a vacation in a foreign country, you ARE rich. It's a luxury that is beyond the vast majority of mankind.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Scottishtourist » Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:42 am

Glyphdoctor wrote:
carrie wrote:When Egyptians see tourists splashing all this money around they think that we live like that every week of the year however many times you try to explain that life is not all a bed of roses in the UK or elsewhere they find it hard to believe. .
Why should they believe really? Leave aside your expenses, you spend more money on your airfare alone than some of them have to live off of for an entire year. Do you realize that to be in the top 1% of earners in Egypt you have to only make 80,000LE a year? That 99% of people make less than that? That's still far below the poverty line in your own country.

If you can take a vacation in a foreign country, you ARE rich. It's a luxury that is beyond the vast majority of mankind.
They should believe cos that's what we are telling them!
They bleat about being poor.That ain't MY problem!I come on holiday for my own benefit...not to subsidise the lives of the "poor locals"who always seem to have enough to go out every nite to coffee shops!
I'm bloody fed up reading about the "poverty"when they probably have more disposable income than me.
And why are you so concerned GD?
Tell them to get off their fat lazy arses and get a job,like the majority of us do in the Western world..instead of always sympathising with them and their lot in life!
Oh God..the Poor Egyptians!Well,poverty is all relative.And it's just tough that they can't afford a vacation!
But..I can..and I shouldn't have to explain the sacrifices I make to enable me to do so.And it ain't a luxury,cos when you work bloody hard,a holiday is a necessity for your own mental and physical wellbeing..not a humanitarian exercise!

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Glyphdoctor » Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:20 am

As a tourist, you will unlikely meet the most desperately poor in this country and if you do, they aren't going to advertise that fact to you as such people have pride and aren't going to advertise their poverty to you. Luxor is relatively well-off by Egyptian standards. But there are millions in other places who live in conditions far worse than even the chickens and goats kept by people in Luxor live. We watched a program on tv 2 nights ago during which they visited some people living in a poor area of Cairo right next to a train track. They were all renting rooms for 100LE a month. That may not seem like a lot, but there were some who had no income at all or just a few hundred a month. The rooms were roofed with broken wood, the walls were peeling and crumbling, especially when the trains passed by everything shook, they had one hole in the floor bathroom shared by dozens of people and one small cold water tap in the common area shared by everyone. Only one family even had a stove and refrigerator. Most had no appliances, no furniture, not even phones, no TVs. Most slept on the ground. Some were living with as many as 6-8 people in these one rooms. There was a canal nearby full of garbage and rats were living there that would frequently come into their rooms. The biggest dream any of them had was to have one living room with a separate bedroom and bathroom, but that clearly was far out of reach of them all. Yes, poverty is relative, and you clearly have no idea how bad it can get.

No one is telling you not to enjoy your holiday. But if you feel enjoying your holiday is incompatible with even feeling compassion for your fellow human beings, then there is something wrong. These two things are in no way related to one another so you choice not to feel compassion is just about your feelings or lack thereof, not about your holiday.
Last edited by Glyphdoctor on Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Dusak » Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:23 am

Scottishtourist wrote:
Glyphdoctor wrote:
carrie wrote:When Egyptians see tourists splashing all this money around they think that we live like that every week of the year however many times you try to explain that life is not all a bed of roses in the UK or elsewhere they find it hard to believe. .
Why should they believe really? Leave aside your expenses, you spend more money on your airfare alone than some of them have to live off of for an entire year. Do you realize that to be in the top 1% of earners in Egypt you have to only make 80,000LE a year? That 99% of people make less than that? That's still far below the poverty line in your own country.

If you can take a vacation in a foreign country, you ARE rich. It's a luxury that is beyond the vast majority of mankind.
They should believe cos that's what we are telling them!
They bleat about being poor.That ain't MY problem!I come on holiday for my own benefit...not to subsidise the lives of the "poor locals"who always seem to have enough to go out every nite to coffee shops!
I'm bloody fed up reading about the "poverty"when they probably have more disposable income than me.
And why are you so concerned GD?
Tell them to get off their fat lazy arses and get a job,like the majority of us do in the Western world..instead of always sympathising with them and their lot in life!
Oh God..the Poor Egyptians!Well,poverty is all relative.And it's just tough that they can't afford a vacation!
But..I can..and I shouldn't have to explain the sacrifices I make to enable me to do so.And it ain't a luxury,cos when you work bloody hard,a holiday is a necessity for your own mental and physical wellbeing..not a humanitarian exercise!
I agree with you that anybody is entitled to take a holiday anywhere they choose, to the level of what they can afford. I know it is still quite common in the UK to borrow the money or use a credit card to pay for it, knowing/hoping that in all probability they can pay it back. The credit card interest for this much needed break would give an Egyptian family a well earned rest, which they, as you are, are entitled to receive. But that is, for most of the population, will forever be, beyond their means.

As you state, a lot ''sit on their fat arses'' in the coffee shops. They are indulging in their cultural heritage and probably spend 1Le while they talk away their hours and play domino's. This is how they wind down. Then its back to the grindstone the next day. And that is because the number of Egyptians that are long term seat warmers number in their hundreds against the millions that have to work to place food on the table. Also at the moment there are probably in excess of 10,000 just in Luxor that have little or no money because of the lack of tourists and in this failing localized economy, there just isn't any replacement jobs to get. Egyptians are not to be blamed because they have lost their income are are unable to find other work, and believe you me, an Egyptian will hunt for work over countless miles to get work out of shear pride to be seen to support his family.

Yes, to their eyes the tourist does seem to be loaded with bags of money, that is just their perception of the tourist which is prevalent in most countries of the world as no matter where you travel to, there will always be some genuine case of hardship sitting by the wayside being forced into begging just to survive. How lucky are you, as I am and a lot more people of this world so do not be so quick to condemn others that by no choice of their own have to suffer on a daily basis.
Life is your's to do with as you wish- do not let other's try to control it for you. Count Dusak- 1345.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Glyphdoctor » Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:35 am

I do recall to that ST has made posts on here in which she described going to the pub on Friday night to wind down after work. I wonder why sitting in a coffee shop is any different?

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Who2 » Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:57 am

Simple difference is it's quite difficult getting pi**ed on a large mocha…… :cool:
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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Dusak » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:29 am

As this was 4.42am post, the thought processing had slowed down, the Dramduie was down to the last dram, the cold was beginning to numb the brain. Sitting on ones fat arse during this period of want soon begins the termination of intelligent and creative jottings. Things will hopefully improve as the day draws on.
Life is your's to do with as you wish- do not let other's try to control it for you. Count Dusak- 1345.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Scottishtourist » Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:36 am

Dusak wrote:As this was 4.42am post, the thought processing had slowed down, the Dramduie was down to the last dram, the cold was beginning to numb the brain. Sitting on ones fat arse during this period of want soon begins the termination of intelligent and creative jottings. Things will hopefully improve as the day draws on.
As this was a 4.42am post(Luxor,not UK time!)some had just finished an extended back shift after a gruelling weeks work and were grateful to have the opportunity to sit on their "fat arse"and enjoy a dram!
We ain't all retired and living in the lap of luxury in Luxor.Some of us work for a living,and live for the moment when we can turn our minds to matters less intense,i.e,slowing down the thought process,enjoying a dram...and leaving work behind just for a short while!

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Scottishtourist » Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:58 am

Glyphdoctor wrote:As a tourist, you will unlikely meet the most desperately poor in this country and if you do, they aren't going to advertise that fact to you as such people have pride and aren't going to advertise their poverty to you. Luxor is relatively well-off by Egyptian standards. But there are millions in other places who live in conditions far worse than even the chickens and goats kept by people in Luxor live. We watched a program on tv 2 nights ago during which they visited some people living in a poor area of Cairo right next to a train track. They were all renting rooms for 100LE a month. That may not seem like a lot, but there were some who had no income at all or just a few hundred a month. The rooms were roofed with broken wood, the walls were peeling and crumbling, especially when the trains passed by everything shook, they had one hole in the floor bathroom shared by dozens of people and one small cold water tap in the common area shared by everyone. Only one family even had a stove and refrigerator. Most had no appliances, no furniture, not even phones, no TVs. Most slept on the ground. Some were living with as many as 6-8 people in these one rooms. There was a canal nearby full of garbage and rats were living there that would frequently come into their rooms. The biggest dream any of them had was to have one living room with a separate bedroom and bathroom, but that clearly was far out of reach of them all. Yes, poverty is relative, and you clearly have no idea how bad it can get.

No one is telling you not to enjoy your holiday. But if you feel enjoying your holiday is incompatible with even feeling compassion for your fellow human beings, then there is something wrong. These two things are in no way related to one another so you choice not to feel compassion is just about your feelings or lack thereof, not about your holiday.
Eh,I posted report last year on my visit to Luxor GD.I was taken by a friend to their home on West Bank and I reported on the poverty I saw there.
And,I got hammered for it from members of this forum!
Don't slate the locals!What's your problem!How dare you!
I probably have more idea of how bad things can get than many there.If I don't...then why were there so many vitriolic replies re my postings?
I'll tell you why!Cos I spoke as a tourist seeing these situations and being shocked by them.
So,don't ever accuse me of not feeling compassion towards anyone living in these circumstances.
It ain't my job to fix it.I have no say...and don't live there!

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Dusak » Sun Dec 08, 2013 5:56 am

I may be wrong, but using the statement ''get off their lazy fat arses'' isn't exactly showing compassion. You are just stereotyping everybody because of a few. And I thought that it was now common knowledge that there are no retired expats in Luxor now. We are all busy as the summers bee's working for the new comity, producing greetings cards plus the usual enterprises. There will shorty be a call for extra labour going out as we are running short of bums on our own seats.
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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Glyphdoctor » Sun Dec 08, 2013 5:57 am

I missed that thread the first time around but I went back and read some of it. Honestly, the only thing that jumped out at me as totally inappropriate in that thread was the fact that several of you, on both sides of the fight that ensued, compared the living conditions of friends and people you know to that of dogs. Culturally, this is really really offensive and inappropriate. Comparing people to dogs, really, is just not something that is done except when you want to insult them.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Brian Yare » Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:49 am

Glyphdoctor wrote: Comparing people to dogs, really, is just not something that is done except when you want to insult them.
The people or the dogs? :snig:

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Who2 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 11:02 am

Must say loved the post regarding paint.
I'm painting tomorrow all my house is different colours one can't expect them to really mix the same colour twice. can you ?
Take these two wall pairings done by "Picasso Tieb 'he who chats' They have had direct sun for 1850 days and, I hose the walls down weekly.
He uses a mixture that the ancients painted the tombs with and all for £40 quid 'cheap I thought then and now!……. :cool:
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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Dusak » Sun Dec 08, 2013 11:57 am

I had paintings similar to these all around my walls [life size] with a massive scene of three temples to the next terrace. Took two artists two weeks to paint at a cost of 4,000Le. They used oil paints and they started to fade after five years. The main problem was the hairline cracks that started to cover the walls so in the end I painted over 90% of them.
Life is your's to do with as you wish- do not let other's try to control it for you. Count Dusak- 1345.

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Re: Good news for Karnak (no I'm not leaving)

Post by Who2 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:01 pm

4000le 'what can I say ? my 'gast is flabbered ! oh well you made a couple of guys very happy for 2 weeks 4000le ? 'gawd…… :cool:
Who remembers Stef (Mohammed) ?, the best painter I ever had, he painted for 6 weeks or more 'mahajuneing the walls and he never even charged 4000le…
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Stef a happy painter...
"The Salvation of Mankind lies in making everything the responsibility of All"
Sophocles.

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