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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 7:42 am  |  Posted from: Egypt
  

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Yildez is this the room you visited when the guardian allowed you onto the roof?


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 7:51 am  |  Posted from: Egypt
  

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LuxorFan wrote:
Many thanks to Horus for posting the pictures.

LLL, In this instance, I believe the rooms are called "blind" because there was no way in or out. At least as part of the original design. There's quite an interesting story that goes along with these pictures. I'll have to reread it to make sure I get the details correct. Its the one Kevin referred to and involves Omm Sety stumbling into a narrow passage filled with artifacts which she later referred to as "the treasurery."


This incident, which occurred in 1958, is described at some length in The Search For Omm Sety....pp 85-87.

Whether her experience was real or imagined remains unclear (she wasn't very well at the time ). Such searches as were made by Omm Sety, and others, subsequently have not revealed this artifact-filled passageway but Omm Sety remained convinced , to her death, that the temple still contained many secrets.


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:25 am  |  Posted from: Turkey
  

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[quote="carrie"]Yildez is this the room you visited when the guardian allowed you onto the roof?[/quote

Did I go on the roof at Abydos? I can't remember doing so! I remember bribing the Guardian to let me onto the roof, but I thought that was at the temple in El Khargi? And you were very afraid of the steps as there was no rail? I've been on the roof of Dendera temple several times, but really can't remember doing so at Abydos!

Mind you, I find it difficult to remember what I did yesterday, so no surprise if I've forgotten :(


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 1:12 pm  |  Posted from: Egypt
  

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Sorry you are right, was El Khargi. Another senior moment I am afraid. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:31 am  |  Posted from: United Kingdom
  

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Caulfeild, A. St. G. (1902) The Temple of the Kings at Abydos (Sety I). London: Egyptian Research Account describes the hidden chambers as follows:

"At the N.W. corner of the temple is an incomprehensible chamber; it had two stone floors, one on a level with the chapel floors, the other about 2' 50 m. higher, carried on two square pillars. The pillars continued upwards from the higher floor and may have carried a roof; but if so, it must have been higher than the chapel roofs, or have left very little head room. There are no doors, no windows, and no steps. One can only imagine that there may have been an opening in the first floor (which is now partly broken), through which prisoners were dropped into the lower chamber; but how the upper chamber was approached, or what the whole contrivance was used for, there is no evidence to show, now that the top has been broken away. Mariette suggests the wells mentioned by Strabo: I suggest a dungeon; and it may equally well have been a corn-bin or a treasury. It was evidently arranged with some care, as it is recessed 25 cm. into the west and north main walls of the temple. The upper chamber is 10' 60 m. long and 6' 40 m, wide. The upper stone floor is of lime. stone slabs about 20 cm. thick, carried on beams running in a north and south direction, which are supported at their middles by the pillars, and let into the walls on either side. The stones of the lower chamber are left rough, the walls of the upper chamber are smooth."

The detail from Plate XXIV, below, illustrates their location and profile.

14267

While I am here, I will also quote from Mariette-Bey, Auguste (1869) Abydos - Description des Fouilles. Tome Premier: Paris: Libraire A. Franck

"105. - SALLE K'. Nous joindrons ici la description d'une salle dont il est bien difficile de déterminer l'usage.

Qu'on se figure une salle de la hauteur de toutes les autres, nue, sans légendes, les pierres des murs à l'état brut. D'immenses blocs horizontaux formant plancher la coupent par le milieu. Pas d'air, pas de fenêtres, pas de portes. Il en résulte deux caves superposées.

Dans chaque cave deux piliers supportent le plafond. Dans l'angle est de la cave d'en bas, quelques marches d'un escalier abandonné côtoient le mur.

La salle K' fut-elle construite seulement pour carrer le plan du temple? On trouve dans quelques temples des souterrains qu'on murait après y avoir enfermé certains objets sacrés; la salle K' serait-elle un de ces souterrains, d'une forme particulière? C'est ce qu'il est difficile de décider.

Quand nous en avons commencé le déblayement, nous étions persuadé que nous avions mis la main sur l'orifice du puits de Strabon (qui aurait été utilisé plus tard par les habitants des villages environnants). Les décombres qui emplissaient la salle étaient, en effet, formées, pour les trois quarts, d'éclats de jarres et d'autres vases à porter de l'eau, ce qui ne s'explique que par le voisinage d'un dépôt de ce liquide. Mais la salle, déblayée jusqu'au fond et explorée jusqu'au-dessous de son dallage inférieur, n'a pas répondu à notre attente."

A machine translation gives:

"105 - ROOM K'. Here, we will join the description of a room which it is difficult to determine the use.

It is figure the height of all room, naked, without legends, the stones of the walls in the rough. Huge horizontal blocks forming floor cut through the middle. No air, no windows, no doors. As a result two superimposed cellars.

In each cellar two pillars support the ceiling. In the angle is the cave of down, a few steps of a staircase abandoned alongside the wall.

K' Hall was built only to square the plan of the temple? It is found in a few temples of the underground were walled after there have locked certain sacred objects; room K' would it be one of these underground, of a particular form? It is what it is hard to decide.

When we first started shovelling, we were convinced that we had put the hand on the hole of the well of Strabo (which would have been used later by the inhabitants of the surrounding villages). The rubble that filled the room were, indeed, formed, for three quarters, of slivers of jars and other vessels to carry water, which is explained by the vicinity of a deposit of this liquid. But the room, cleared the way and explored to below its lower floor, did not respond to our expectation."


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:54 am  |  Posted from: United Kingdom
  

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Thank you for that Brian some interesting points being raised and after seeing the temple plan and the columnar hall I wonder if its purpose was nothing more than a construction to relieve any sideways pressure from the columns and roof? In the same way that they added the relieving chambers in the Great Pyramid to divert the load around the kings chamber, it may be that a similar thing was done at Abydos. If you have a free standing row of columns with a heavy roof they are very vulnerable to toppling over, so is it possible that this hollow block construction does a similar thing in forming an end support?

____________________________________________


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 1:10 pm  |  Posted from: United Kingdom
  

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Many thanks here Brian for your write up and your interest.

As I am sure you will have noticed my initial post here was to help our friend Frater understand Abydos, I wanted to do this in stages, however he put a 'spanner' in the workings, after this my further posts were met with sarcastic comment, and as a rule these people usually know more, so I withdrew. I am grateful to Kevin-in-Abydos for his authorised posts, though quite understandable why others of his quality, are so missed these days.

Anyhow Brian, for your benefit alone I write this,........

As I am sure you are aware, there was a much earlier temple at Abydos than you see today. The present one was totally re-modelled, and planned to a fine detail, certainly avoiding the need for what you mentioned above. Look carefully, you will notice that Amoun Ra occupies the central position in this temple. Why ? Horus shrine is shunted to the north end, almost as an after thought. Why ? Even in the beautiful separate chapel, Horus has to share this with his wife and son. Why ? (Both have there own separate fantastic temples elsewhere).

Food for thought Brian, food for thought.


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 3:36 pm  |  Posted from: United Kingdom
  

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The secrets that are so in Egypt today, are there simply because they have not been solved yet, and that is why it takes time to discover the truth, with perhaps a few surprises along the journey,.................but first, one has to start those journeys that still hold such secrets.


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 3:57 pm  |  Posted from: Denmark
  

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A-Four wrote:
I wanted to try and give Frater an improved understanding, and an introduction to the rather complex history, ritual,etc of Abydos, but as you can see this failed at the first hurdle.
...
Please write on here anything so far that you do not understand, and I will answer to my best ability, then I shall write further information, perhaps in stages to help you have a clearer understanding of Abydos.
...
To study the details of Abydos takes a great deal of time, then you say to your self, 'Hm, very interesting", but it takes a hell of a lot longer time of very careful study before you realise the secrets.
...
Abydos Temple has a very long history, the reason for its sudden change in artistic style, the deep meaning of the Eye of Horus within the Hall of Osiris, the Tomb of Osiris and its connection with the Temple all need to be explained. Finally the one item that brings all this together a secret hidden room, that has no doors, though it was built on two levels, it is known by a number of names, the secret chamber, the treasury, the blind room, though myself after very careful observation of that room, in my opinion it should be called the Spirit of Truth.
...
Evidently such detailed information can not be written up on here in ten minutes, and each section needs to be understood.
...
The secrets that are so in Egypt today, are there simply because they have not been solved yet, and that is why it takes time to discover the truth, with perhaps a few surprises along the journey,.................


:a11:
A-Four wrote:
.................but first, one has to start those journeys that still hold such secrets.


:a25: If one has the patience ... :a48:


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 4:09 pm  |  Posted from: Egypt
  

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I'm glad somebody was able to make sense of A-Four's latest contribution :urm:


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:16 pm  |  Posted from: United States
  

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So tell me did you know that there was a huge palace in that area just a mile or two from Seti's temple it may have been reused from a time before.


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:32 pm  |  Posted from: United States
  

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Oh what about the lake there Newscastlet did you know that there was a body of water nearbye?


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:41 pm  |  Posted from: United Kingdom
  

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Dear Frater,

In my initial post on this subject I asked that you follow each account of what I wrote in stages, so that you carefully understood how Abydos was, and still is important today, though as I have said previously, remain 'secret'. I see your last two posts have once again taken the subject off at a tangent, therefore, I will give you just one more clue that you really need to study in relation to Abydos.

In all respect, you need to spend probably at least five days at Abydos to clearly understand what is modern day restoration, the full lay out of the temple as set out by Seti, but perhaps more importantly the floor plan of the original temple.

To clearly understand OSIRIS, we can compare him with the Jesus of Christianity. When the blessing by a priest is given in a church, we hear "God, the father, God, the son, and God the HOLY SPIRIT". This term Holy Spirit is rather vague to most Christians, yet I assure you, it was alive and kicking in the ancient Egyptian Faith. Like all people at that time in Egypt they needed a 'spirit room', or perhaps more commonly known as their own private 'room of eternity'.

What we now have to understand Frater,......is this, we are aware of the 'spirit room' of the re-built 19th Dynasty temple, but where was it in the original ? Some have referred it to 'the Treasury'. With your knowledge Frater, I wonder what you would call it ?


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:19 am  |  Posted from: United States
  

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Secrets of the sands hmm that would be a good book title for you news castle. You should definitely do all the research and start the investigation

I toss all my shovels and drills to you, oh and here is some water. Please past on your information via a book.


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 Post subject: Re: Abydos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:10 am  |  Posted from: Egypt
  

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