British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by HEPZIBAH »

Ministry revokes 2 Sharm hotel licenses after rape of tourist reported

Hilton Sharks Bay and Sharm Holiday Resort licenses are withdrawn by Egypt's tourism ministry after reports of sexual abuse; ministry imposes measures to deter future occurences.

The licenses of two hotels in Egypt's Red Sea resort city of Sharm El-Sheikh were revoked after sexual harassment cases occurring at the hotels were ignored by management, state news agency MENA reported on Tuesday.

Tourism Minister Hesham Zaazou's decision was taken against the five-star Hilton Sharks Bay Resort and the four-star Sharm Holiday Resort.

The decision comes after a holidaymaker, a British businesswoman in her 40s, told the Daily Mail she had been raped by a security guard in an unnamed five-star hotel in Sharm El-Sheikh.

Egypt's tourism ministry said on Monday it was investigating the alleged rape.

ZaaZou said in 2013 that the previous year the ministry discovered 3 cases of rape and 150 cases of sexual harassment in Sharm El-Sheikh alone.

The Ministry of Tourism notified the Egyptian Chamber of Hotels it will exercise its legal authority according to Law 1 of 1973, which grants it the right to withdraw hotel licenses when acceptable public conduct is breached or if the hotel contributes to "harming the country's reputation or security," according to MENA.

The same source also reported that the ministry directed the head of Egypt's Chamber of Travel Agencies to take immediate legal action against any tourism worker who sexually harasses a tourist by filing a case at the office of the General Prosecution detailing the abuse reported by the victim.

The ministry additionally requested the chamber provide it with a copy of any future report, including the name of the touristic venue where the abuse took place.

Meanwhile, tourism ministry spokesperson Rasha El-Azazy told Ahram Online on Monday “We are following the reported incident with the British embassy and local tourism police, and the case is currently under investigation.”

A severe punishment will be imposed if the ministry confirms the crime, Azazy added.

Source: http://english.ahram.org.eg/News/97515.aspx


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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Dusak »

Mad Dilys wrote:
Glyphdoctor wrote:Dog bites man, man bites dog. Look it up if you don't understand the reference.

Brian-I hate to say this, but it has to be said, you really need to get a physician to evaluate your obsessive-compulsive tendencies. I don't think you are an asshole (or whatever Keefy's stars represent) but your behavior is certainly out of the ordinary. It's been quite obvious since your post where you complained about 47 or 26 or whatever number stairs to get to the roof of a restaurant. No normal person counts the number of stairs they have to climb and memorizes it, or thinks to call an airline up to ask them the exact temperature and air pressure in their luggage hold, and no normal person splits hairs like you are doing now.
Crikey! :o

No hope for me then :sd I count everything I do, for example:- 2 Weetabix topped by 20 thin slices of banana and three spoons of soya yoghurt for my breakfast........................... :?
That's two of us then MD as I've been a compulsive counter all my life. :up

No matter the reasons, or the arguments, comments, gender or guess work, rape is rape, one of the most nasty and vile acts a human being can commit against another. :stp
Life is your's to do with as you wish- do not let other's try to control it for you. Count Dusak- 1345.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by LovelyLadyLux »

On this topic - I, for one, am glad the rape was reported, is being followed up legally with investigation(s) and sanctions are being levied.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by BENNU »

HEPZIBAH wrote:I wish there had been an explanation as to why a women staying in a 5* (or any other star come to that) hotel needed a security guard to take her to her room!
Who says that she needed anything? He "walks with her" and pulls her into her room - I read it as he followed her. I doubt that she invited him. It should not be necessary for guests to protect themselves against security staff. I have avoided security men who tried chatting me up in hotels or walk beside me in the gardens, just like I would any man on the Corniche, but a holiday maker feeling safe in a guarded resort may not be prepared to be tough and ignore "friendly" staff.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Glyphdoctor »

http://thecairopost.com/news/103662/new ... y-harassed

What were there men doing in the sauna? Wasn't there some law passed a couple years ago about single-sex spas? Anyone remember?

And why such drastic measures for foreign women when Egyptian women are treated differently? Comparing this to what happened at Cairo U last week, you can see there is a really horrible double standard.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by HEPZIBAH »

BENNU wrote:
HEPZIBAH wrote:I wish there had been an explanation as to why a women staying in a 5* (or any other star come to that) hotel needed a security guard to take her to her room!
Who says that she needed anything? He "walks with her" and pulls her into her room - I read it as he followed her. I doubt that she invited him. It should not be necessary for guests to protect themselves against security staff. I have avoided security men who tried chatting me up in hotels or walk beside me in the gardens, just like I would any man on the Corniche, but a holiday maker feeling safe in a guarded resort may not be prepared to be tough and ignore "friendly" staff.
You are right BENNU. It doesn't say she needed a security guard, that was my understanding when I read the article and need was my word. Equally though I don't read it as he followed her. What it actually says is 'The guard had been walking with the woman back to her room ...' which still leaves me wishing there was an explanation as to why he was walking with her.
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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by BENNU »

HEPZIBAH wrote: which still leaves me wishing there was an explanation as to why he was walking with her.
Because he could.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Cyprus100 »

There's no accounting for those who are OCD but at the end of the day a person was raped. The gender doesn't really matter...

Perhaps the guard offered to walk her back to her room and she felt she was safe in allowing him to do so?

People don't always have the same inhibitions when they're in holiday mode and do things completely out of the ordinary than they would at home. I've always felt safe on hotel complexes in Egypt and if I'd seen a guard around a few times and perhaps he'd acknowledged me in passing I probably wouldn't have thought twice about it either - other than to maybe tell him I knew how to get to my room.

As has been mentioned we pretty much always have a torch with us when we go on holiday to Egypt and a few other places but not everyone is aware of the need to do so.

Given that Sharm is supposed to be the only "safe" place recommended at the moment to visit - it's going to cast some doubt on the future for tourism if cases like these keep hitting the press. Maybe we should be more worried about that?
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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by dsaxelby »

These hotels are huge complexes, and at night found them quite creepy, our room was at the other end of the reception, we would have been happy for an escort to our room :o or at least our block, recall had a creepy neighbour who kept opening the door when we came back.

But hey grew up near the Aylesbury and Camden Estate in South East London. :sd
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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by LovelyLadyLux »

Further to Glyph's stats......IMO -

Wondering how the Guard happened to be 'with' the woman is, a little bit, to me putting some of the blame on the woman. Shouldn't have mattered if the Guard was walking/talking with her, in front of her, behind her, passing her, had been dancing with her, dining with her or standing guard at her door. Shouldn't matter if she asked him to escort her and then talked to him etc etc etc - HE engaged in a behavior that by the standards of any group of people is wrong wrong wrong on mega fronts and should be treated with extreme seriousness and severity. Rape is rape. Full stop.

Statistically speaking - Where it gets a bit "grey" for me is sexual harassment. Am fully, 100% affirming sexual harassment IS over the top in Egypt however sometimes the definitions of 'sexual harassment' are not totally clear and what one person might deem harassing another might not. Doesn't mitigate that Egyptian women do have to contend with extremely high incidents of harassment and what I believe compounds the issue for Egyptian women is that they do not have a voice to complain. Complaining that they have been sexually harassed/assaulted in an odd cultural way seems to indicate they're "spoiled goods" which also says to me that statistics for Egyptian women experiencing rape is probably quite a bit higher than is reported.

I only hope that the Powers that Be in Egypt try and make something good out of this rape by way of Public Education as to what is appropriate or not, where you can go European/Egyptian/SpaceAlien if you are assaulted or harassed to informed proactive understanding persons who will HELP you and not push your concern under the carpet, minimize it or take the WORST course of action - AND - BLAME the VICTIM.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Glyphdoctor »

Stats? What stats?

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by dsaxelby »

The man was a security guard, immediately especially as a first time traveller would have put your mind at ease. We are English and if nothing else polite! someone talks to us we respond, it is our nature and in many cases our downfall, or our vulnerability which is abused and exploited in Egypt.

The woman is in her 40's! Tarred with a brush by not only Egyptians but also many ex-pats as a desperate woman for sex. A stereotype perhaps.

Perhaps this 40ish woman came to Egypt to get laid, chatted to a guard (man in uniform) allowed him to her room and did not like it!!!!!! and so complained to the tourist police. Possible of course but I seriously doubt it.

This woman had the bravery to face and to report a terrible thing that happened to her, now everyone will know and judge her and yet she had the courage to do this. If you have ever made a report to the tourist police in Egypt, not quite like an English police station I can assure you.

It happens a lot it is just not reported, so my hat is off to this lady for her courage, bravery which I hope may save someone else from the experience.
It is what it is.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by LovelyLadyLux »

Stats? What stats?
Sorry - I meant the stats in the article you gave the URL of: http://thecairopost.com/news/103662/new ... y-harassed

Reading back it does kinda sound like YOURS but I'm talking about the 99+% in the article stats.......

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by LovelyLadyLux »

@ Dsaxelby - LOTS of women never report because reporting means they WILL be judged, WILL be blamed, WILL be accused of all manner of everything - AND this happens in OUR supposedly open societies where we're supposed to understand, be supportive of the victim and where we can parade our sexuality openly like a badge for all to know. I think we making strides or steps in this area but we're far from getting out of Victorian England so to speak.

Can't image how it must be for an Egyptian person if they come forward. They have to be beyond brave. Can't even imagine what it would take for an Egyptian person to report. They have everything to lose - absolutely everything. Not only have they suffered a horrible heinous act this is then compounded when they're further not believed and blamed.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Bombay »

Well most of the restaurants in Luxor won't need to worry they ain't got nothing to revoke :lol:

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Chocolate Eclair »

You hear all these stories coming out of Egypt at the moment, it makes you wonder if these incidents are only now getting reported and what was going on earlier. i think maybe the new found freedom of the people makes them feel like they are infallible and they can get away with anything.I hate to hear stories of rape and sexual assaults they violate society, but is this the age of a new society? I hope not.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Glyphdoctor »

That's the thing that has perplexed me a bit about this story, CE. There have been other incidents like this, so why does this one make the news? As far as I understand it, she didn't report anything in Egypt, but waited until she got home. So where's the proof? Can she prove that he raped her at this point? You need physical evidence.

Even if they have security camera footage of him entering her room with her, it would not prove rape. She could have invited him in. I am a bit alarmed by the seeming rush here to punish the man when in fact, he may be completely and utterly innocent. And unless and until there is proof, I think the guy should walk free. Otherwise, any man working in the tourism industry should be very worried that a foreign woman can say anything about him and get him thrown in prison and get an entire hotel shut down in the process. This is not justice.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by DJKeefy »

Glyphdoctor wrote:Otherwise, any man working in the tourism industry should be very worried that a foreign woman can say anything about him and get him thrown in prison and get an entire hotel shut down in the process. This is not justice.
I have to agree with Glyph here.

About 10 years ago, I was talking to a guy I knew at that time for a few years, he worked as room service at a 5 star hotel in Luxor, he told me that an old woman demanded sex from him, he told her NO, she then said she would report him for sexual advances if he did not, so he had intercourse with her, I asked why? he said cause the authorities would believe a tourist over an Egyptian, and the shame it would fetch on him and his family. I can't verify if it's true or not, but he did seem like an honest type of guy.

I thought (in law) You are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty, seems that's not the case in Egypt :(
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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by Glyphdoctor »

Then there is also the problem of women with mental illness who imagine things happen that didn't.

A couple years ago I was a member of a FB group, and then one morning I woke up to find out I had been kicked out of the group. A friend who was also in the group told me it was because one of the other members of the group had, among other things I don't recall, accused me of hacking her email and sending emails to her children telling them she was a terrorist. And somehow the admin believed her. I didn't even know her email address or that she even had children, especially because she had mentioned an infertility issue with an Egyptian ex. It was way over the top and odd but I just let it go.

Anyway, I forgot about the incident until a couple weeks ago when my husband mentioned a physical disease I know this woman had. I told him about the incident and asked him if this disease can make someone have such strange delusions. And he told me that psychosis is one of the main symptoms of the disease.

So the moral of the story is people don't only have the capability of making things up, they also may suffer from illnesses that make them convinced that something outrageous happened against them that didn't. This is why collecting physical evidence of a rape immediately is so essential.

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Re: British Tourist Raped in Sharm el Sheik

Post by newcastle »

I agree with DJK & GD that there has been a rush to judgement here. It's becoming apparent (maybe it always was) that the Egyptian judicial system is not fit for purpose ( the recent death sentencing case ?) and I hope addressing this issue is high on the list of priorities of the new government. In a bizarre way it's encouraging to see that the courts can behave in such an arbitrary way. It indicates (to me at least) that they are not, as some maintain, under the control of the government. On the contrary, the government is frequently engaged in trying to clear up the mess created by dubious 'legal' procedures. The letter from the interim president (no less) to the parents on the incarcerated journalist assuring them of his efforts on their behalf. his intervention in the schoolgirl case etc. all demonstrate a judicial system that has gone off the rails and ploughing into disaster outside of governmental control.

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