Banning the Niqab

Luxor has both Christian and Moslem communities and the politics of the Middle East are equally diverse. Air your views on the situation.

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Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:51 am

The Islamic Central Council of Switzerland (IRZS) published a German-language video in which it protested against the initiative to ban the niqab in the country. The video, which was posted on the YouTube channel of the IRZS on July 15, shows a niqab-clad woman participating in various sports and recreational activities, including riding a kick scooter, working out on an exercise bike, boxing, and eating pizza, and culminating in jumping from a bridge into the river.


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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Dusak » Sun Sep 24, 2017 6:53 pm

Her snorter looks to be a big one, perhaps the real reason she wants to wear it in public. :lol:
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:27 pm

It's good to see that wearing the niqab is no obstacle to everyday "activities". I'm quite partial to leaping off bridges myself.

But I'd like to see the woman touching up her lipstick in a hand held mirror before reaching a final conclusion on the subject.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Major Thom » Mon Sep 25, 2017 3:40 am

Looks like a mans profile, maybe he has set something in an ally way nearby. They have helped many a wrong doer escape, and are a symbol of male dominance. Besides that Switzerland is a Christian Country, and strongly believes in Christian values.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Major Thom » Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:33 am

I bet no one saw the picture of the Australian Policeman ripping the Niqab off a Muslim Woman. My friends send me snippets of media information and there is a big anti Muslim thing going on in Oz, maybe they do not want to see their Christian values disappear.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:34 am

Major Thom wrote:I bet no one saw the picture of the Australian Policeman ripping the Niqab off a Muslim Woman. My friends send me snippets of media information and there is a big anti Muslim thing going on in Oz, maybe they do not want to see their Christian values disappear.
Exaggerating again are we?

You won't find pictures of "Australian Policeman ripping the Niqab off a Muslim Woman" because it never happened in front of a camera.

Like many other auhorities, Australian police can require a niqab wearing woman to show her face...in connection with a suspected offence, in court etc. It's even possible that a niqab could be forcibly removed from a woman who was resisting the request.....but such an act should be performed by female officers.

There have been a number of cases in Australia of police being accused of improper behaviour with regard to niqab-wearing women. I'm not aware of any leading to a prosecution....other than that of the woman concerned for making false accusations.

In the recent case MT refers to, the fact that female officers were not involved, and the woman was left in custody without her hijab for some time, has led to a the woman receiving significant compensation for what amounted to excessively abusive police procedure.

I'm not sure if it was the case in the Australian incident, but these "militant" niqab-wearers often turn out to be western 'converts' :urm:

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Mad Dilys » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:14 am

Covering the face and hands is not required by the Koran, but in my experience many Middle Eastern women do this to stop from tanning, keeping their skin as light as possible. I have a neighbour in Luxor who suddenly started to wear the niqab and gloves when she got to middle age. Young women also wear it because they feel insecure about their facial features - just as Westerrn girls cover their faces with layers of make up and wear false eyelashes etc. Many girls won't let anyone see them without their slap on, but of course there is a huge difference between veiling with make up and masking with the niqab while the reason for doing so remains the same.
By the way, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I've not seen women inside the Mosque in Mecca wearing the niqab as they pray alongside men in accordance with Islam. Why are women segregated for prayer outside Mecca? In my opinion because of the enemy of mankind - Tradition. :td

While we are about it, I wonder about the "security aspects" of current trend for so called "Hipsters", Western men growing huge bushy beards obscuring the lower half of their face. Think about it. :urm:
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by A-Four » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:36 am

I was in Austria last week, and from reading the news there, the Burqa is banned in that country as of either yesterday or today.

They would have you believe that Austria is a very modern forward thinking liberal country,......believe me, the majority of the people I come across there are very right wing, almost frightening.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Dusak » Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:03 am

Well, I aint shaving mine off! Doing so would deprive me off my midnight nibbles as I sift through it later on after my meals have finished. :eat
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Horus » Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:46 pm

Today the Austrian police have already started to enforce the new law
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/austrian-burq ... 04687.html
German Chancellor Angela Merkel has previously indicated her support for a similar law in Germany, saying: “Our law takes precedence over codes of honor, tribal or family rules, and over sharia law.”
You can't really argue with that 8)
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:16 pm

I don't agree with banning the niqab when worn by a muslim woman walking about in the street.

What's the problem?

I don't think it should be allowed where facial expression is an integral part of the social intercourse.....hospitals, schools etc. And I can see some point in requiring its removal before entering a bank, jewelers etc.

But walking in the street??

I believe there are about 150 niqab wearers in Austria. They might be flattered to have a law designed especially for them :lol:

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Horus » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:22 pm

One could reasonably argue that as street surveillance is now quite an important part of our everyday security that it interferes with that process, even if it is just walking down the street.
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:58 pm

Yep....Big Brother is coming to your streets soon!

So...no mufflers...or scarves worn too high over the face (no matter now cold & windy)

No hoods...unless walking with head raised and face in full view.

In fact...no walking with downturned face..

Umbrellas may be used only if they do not obscure the carrier's face. (Should improve sale of see-through umbrellas!)

Absolutely no funny Thatcher or Trump masks ( special permission may be granted for private parties in licensed establishments).

There was an interesting "Click" programme recently on facial recognition software. Way to go in terms of effectiveness and reliability.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Dusak » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:13 pm

Personally I think such rulings just generate more problems, creating hatred in those Muslims that only need a slight nudge to cross the line to demonstrate their dislike towards what they perceive as an insult to their religion by other religions or none believers, whether the wearing of the niqab is expected in their understanding of Islamic law or not.
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:51 pm

Dusak wrote:Personally I think such rulings just generate more problems, creating hatred in those Muslims that only need a slight nudge to cross the line to demonstrate their dislike towards what they perceive as an insult to their religion by other religions or none believers, whether the wearing of the niqab is expected in their understanding of Islamic law or not.
Totally agree.

It's not quite islamophobic.....more islamo-I-really-feel-uncomfortable-seeing-an-overt-display-of-islamic-dress.

A bit like someone who declares they're totally ok with gays but feels slightly queasy when confronted with two guys mincing towards them, hand in hand, down Old Compton Street, Soho, wearing pink lycra hotpants and leather caps :lol:

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Horus » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:46 pm

Again quoting Mad Merkel
“Our law takes precedence over codes of honor, tribal or family rules, and over sharia law.”
And the rights and wrongs of public surveillance is not the issue here, the issue is that we all comply if that is what the law states.
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Major Thom » Tue Oct 03, 2017 1:01 am

When you talk about Big Brother Newc. there is no bigger brother than the police and military in Luxor, towards foreigners, I bet they know the times you visit the loo everyday. Now that is big brother, doing their best to get something on you so they can revoke your visa's. When they can find nothing they just make it up!! I remember 3 or 4 years ago we had tom have an interview with the secret police and take documents with us they required. the interview took place at the guards gate outside the offices, not even in the station itself. When it was my turn the guy said papers please I duly handed them over and told him what they were. He turned round and said we know all about you, so I took the papers back off him and told him he would not require them if that was the case. Needless to say we only got 3 months visa that time. But could not care a toss because 9 weeks later we were going to see my daughter for a month. I remember when discussing it over tea one night my daughter burst out laughing and said, well you got your comeuppance dad, now see if they let you back in again, but by that time we really could not care a damn if they did or did not, we were finished with even thinking of the S--- they come up with in the pursuit of milking the European Money Cows.
Oh incidentally did they enforce the charging for using social media, or was that another stupid idea after consideration.
Did hey ever publish how much money they raised in fines for littering the streets campaign, or even how much they raised for watering the streets. It used to make us laugh, we could never believe the amount of stupid ideas that came out of one place. The only good thing that came out while we were living there was the suggestion of banning orfi marriages, did they do it or was it another pie in the sky jobbie that fell along the wayside. It must be disheartening to see the results of these great ideas.

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:17 am

the issue is that we all comply if that is what the law states.
Then I can't see what your problem was with Egypt MT.

You moan if they apply the law regarding visas.

You moan if they don't apply it elsewhere.

Still, now you've moved to Utopia Cyprus you must be a happier bunny :urm:

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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by Dusak » Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:54 am

I hope you will have no need to come back into Egypt when the investments you spoke of mature. But then again, they will probably have cashed them in on your behalf by now. :D
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Re: Banning the Niqab

Post by newcastle » Tue Oct 03, 2017 3:31 pm

Horus wrote:Again quoting Mad Merkel
“Our law takes precedence over codes of honor, tribal or family rules, and over sharia law.”
And the rights and wrongs of public surveillance is not the issue here, the issue is that we all comply if that is what the law states.
I'm all for the superiority of the law.

As far as I known, only France, Belgium and Austria have blanket bans on the niqab.

It seems the rest of the world ( including Mad Merkel's Germany) have a more nuanced approach to the issue.

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