I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

A light-hearted section of Jokes - Text Games - Only In Egypt Photos and Videos - Brainteasers and General Fun Stuff to while away the spare minutes of your day.

Moderators: DJKeefy, 4u Network

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Wed Sep 25, 2019 9:15 am




User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 25, 2019 9:47 am

Quite right too comrade it has always worked for us before, put up 11 unelected men and women to run a few show trials, it always worked for us in Russia and China, keeps the proletariat in check. The trick is to let the people think they have a vote, long live the Communist er Labour party.
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Wed Sep 25, 2019 10:16 am

Unless you can envisage a society with a population less than 100 - where 1 man 1 vote referendums on all matters are practicable- there’s always going to be an issue over “representative democracy”.

Ours isn’t perfect...and obviously misunderstood by many....the root cause of so much of the vitriol being slung about.

Hopefully, a lesson has been learnt that, if you’re going to have a meaningful referendum ( and not just a government sponsored opinion poll), make the question unambiguously clear and make the result binding in law, irrespective of the views and wishes of Parliament.

Whilst “yes” or “no” to leaving the EU might seem abundantly clear and unambiguous, it obviously wasn’t to large numbers....or we wouldn’t have had the fracas that ensued !

Pity the poor Americans , the majority of whom voted for Clinton....and got Trump instead! :lol:

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 25, 2019 11:23 am

The 11 supreme court judges, all appointed by other judges and not one peasant amongst them, they should now be open to more public scrutiny and their political leanings, they cannot be truly neutral. They have made a far reaching interference in our political system that will undoubtedly come back to bite them. When you say that people do not understand it, well that is just your opinion and typical of the “we know better than you” attitude being displayed by politicians and now judges. We do not have written constitution and until we do then all judges decisions are based upon what? That they can read the PM’s mind? How can they say with impartiality that he deceived the Queen? He took the advice of the Attorney General that it was a legal proroguing of Parliament, so the highest QC in the land does not know the law and neither do the judges of the other three High Courts who ruled it was legal, but this eleven judges do? Our parliamentary system is based upon the separation of Parliament from the Judiciary, neither impinges upon the others sphere of operation. If we had a written constitution then it would be fine for a judge to interpret the legal aspects of that constitution, but as we do not then their decision is just based upon opinion and not law. This decision will cast a shadow over politics for a long time to come and hopefully open the debate concerning the role of a non elected House of Lords and judicial appointments that have more in common with the machinations of the Medici family than a democracy.

The Remoaners always claim, “The Brexit vote was swayed by the older age group who had no right to decide the future of the younger generation” I wish they would make up their minds. 8)
Lady Hale, 74
Lord Reed, 63
Lord Kerr, 71
Lord Wilson, 74
Lord Carnwath, 74
Lord Hodge, 66
Lady Black, 65
Lord Lloyd-Jones, 67
Lady Arden, 72
Lord Kitchin, 64
Lord Sales, 57
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Wed Sep 25, 2019 1:17 pm

Judges are appointed by the Queen on the advice of the Prime Minister.

There’s not many “peasants “ among them as they invariably have to have law degrees and decades of experience in the courts administering justice.

They are human, and will inevitably have innate prejudices. Their duty is to disregard these in interpreting the Law.


We do not have a codified Constitution....but one which consists of principles which have emerged over the centuries from statute, case law, political conventions and social consensus. The role of the judiciary is to interpret these principles as they apply to any matter brought before them.

If any law officer’s opinion is likely to be suspect it’s the Attorney General! He’s under obvious pressure from the PM and his party. Remember Blair and Iraq?

They did not say that Boris Johnson deceived the Queen.

Nor do I understand your reference to contrary judgements in 3 lower courts. I recall the Scottish Court also held the proroguing unlawful. And the Appeal court in London wouldn’t hear the case.

When I say that many people do not understand how our parliamentary democracy works it is not a matter of opinion.......but one of blindingly obvious fact.

Our MP’s are there to represent us.....but not necessarily to blindly follow our wishes, however expressed. And certainly not wishes expressed in a non-binding Referendum. It’s painfully obvious from the debate over the last 3 years that this fundamental aspect of our Constitution is not understood by many. Parliament is sovereign.....not “the people”. You can google any number of sources confirming this essential element of our parliamentary democracy. Let me know if you find any contrary views.

You may not like it....and one might argue for a different system...but that is the one we have.

And finally, whilst I fully understand people’s feeling that they were misled by statements made during the Referendum and the apparent politicising of the matter as it was debated by Parliament, their recourse to deal with MP’s who they feel have lied, or failed to carry out their wishes, is to vote them out at the next General Election....which can’t be far away now.

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 25, 2019 2:46 pm

Regardless of how you try to dress it up, other than the Scottish law court (as would be expected) no other UK court or legal advisor said it was illegal and of course it was not. The Supreme court ruled on that particular prorogation and then enacted it into law, they made a new law on what was previously an unwritten Parliamentary convention. It could therefore not be illegal at the time he prorogued Parliament as that law had not yet come into force, it was only law after the judgement was made so how on earth had he broken the law when he was acting on the advice of his Attorney General, therefore up until that point he was acting perfectly legally. As to an election, those so knowledgeable Supreme court judges could have quite simply settled the issue by telling Parliament what they should be doing and that is to pass a motion of no confidence in the current government and that way the issue would have been settled. Why did they not castigate the opposition for all of their gerrymandering tactics to stop Brexit by fair means or foul, they have used every trick in the book and if our democracy is indeed based on convention then they broken that several times by not calling for an election, but no! They chose to manipulate the system then shout their artificial rage when Boris does the same, hypocrites all of them they have put our democracy back decades and made our country a laughing stock.
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:14 pm

You seem to think you know the Law better than the judges of the Supreme Court. So be it.

I suggest you read the actual judgement. https://www.supremecourt.uk/cases/docs/ ... ummary.pdf

Apart from the Scottish Court, and the English Court which declined to rule, no other Court has considered the matter. The statement that no other legal advisor has said it was illegal is just nonsense! What do you think Gina Miller’s barristers were claiming?

As for the judges dictating what Parliament, or its members, should have done, or should do next, that would clearly be beyond their remit.

They are there to interpret the law.....no more, no less.

And they are our sole bastion between a dictatorship.....or anarchy.

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:52 pm

Lawyers love to talk and that is demonstrated every day in Parliament, half the house must be comprise of failed lawyers, just listen to them all postulating about how many angels can fit on the head of a pin, self serving and self opinionated. But again I don’t really know why I am arguing with you, these Remoaners will get their way by hook or by crook, too many vested interests to leave the gravy train without a fight although I now reckon the average voter has seen through the smoke screens and will make up their minds accordingly. Roll on the revolution with comrade Corbyn in charge he will soon put the squeeze on the fat cats who care more about themselves than the people, I am looking forward to all my freebies and the ensuing chaos that the likes of you have created. I bet you were one of those suckers who ran about like headless chickens when the ‘experts’ were predicting end of the world doom gloom and chaos with the Year 2K computer meltdown that never happened. :lol: :lol:
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:55 pm

Try not to be insulting Horus. It doesn’t take the debate anywhere and you’re beginning to sound like Bert from the White Swan - after he’s had a few too many. :wi

Talking of lawyers and hot air, seeing the Attorney General ranting in Parliament was good for a laugh :lol: The riposte from that bloke on the Labour benches wasn’t much better.

Heaven knows what any foreigner viewing it must think.

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 25, 2019 10:09 pm

Try not to be insulting Horus. It doesn’t take the debate anywhere and you’re beginning to sound like Bert from the White Swan - after he’s had a few too many.
Talk about Pot & Kettle 8)
I also watched the debates all day today and for sure the Attorney General and Boris certainly smacked the arses of those screeching Labour Haridans who would not have been out of place in the Tuileries with their knitting. What a sour faced and gutless bunch they are, he certainly put your hero Corbyn in his place, it was like prodding a dead dog with a stick. :lol: :lol:
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:07 am

“your hero Corbyn” ????

Oh dear...you really have not been paying attention :lol: You seem to be unable to carry on a discussion without imagining - inventing - the political affiliations of others.

Ever heard of the term “devil’s advocate” ....or, following your French theme “agent provocateur”?

Time to lay off the Kool Aid Horus! :))) :))) :)))

P.S. The tricoteuses would have missed all the fun in the Tuileries. You mean Place de la Concorde.

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:20 am

Our resident fount of all knowledge has spoken, obviously completely unaware that the Guillotine was dragged from street to street after the initial executions had taken place which were near the Louvre and not the Plas de la Concorde, that location was used for the executions of Louis XVI and his family and that is adjacent to the Tuileries. Also as the Tuileries are positioned between the two locations I have mentioned, I leave the readers to make up their own minds who was giving the more accurate location of the Guillotine whilst in use. It spent even longer in the Place Du Carrousel from 1792 to 1793, therefore even closer to the Tuilerie Palace where the royal family was initially being held. As to me laying off the Kool Aid, I would suggest that you take some history lessons or at least become familiar with the Paris layout. 8)
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:12 am

If you’d originally said “close to” the Tuileries, there’d be no argument.

Most of the time, executions in Paris were carried out in the Place de la Revolution (former Place Louis XV and current Place de la Concorde)....
The machine was moved several times, to the Place de la Nation and the Place de la Bastille, but returned, particularly for the execution of the King and for Robespierre.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guillotine

Neither the guillotine, nor the tricoteuses, were ever in the Tuileries .

And you really should try to lay off terms like “fount of all knowledge” and similar phrases you’ve used in the past when confronted with someone who challenges you. It says more about you, and your insecurities, than anything else. :ct

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Thu Sep 26, 2019 5:13 pm

You just cannot abide to be wrong can you Newcastle? Your normal response is to pick at a minor point and then add your own waffle to it, you have managed to turn an innocent remark about women knitting at the guillotine into an argument. Why did there need to be a precise location to within 50 metres of where it was set up? I’ll tell you why, because you always have to be the one who corrects everyone else, the one who peppers his replies with school boy Latin and a smattering of French in order to look the most knowledgeable and therefore superior, well you are not. As to challenging my point of view, have you ever looked at your own replies? At least I put up a reasoned personal opinion whether it be right or wrong, but you mock and sneer if it disagrees with your view as you do with the likes of A4, MT or John Langdon. I often find JL’s theories laughable, but I always try to put up a reasoned counter to his claims whereas you just mock. Your favourite emoji is the ROFL which you usually add beneath A4s posts, he may not always be giving us the correct or even up to date information, but at least he tries and it does not require your constant ridicule.

Now I see you have added psychoanalyst to the long list of things you feel you are qualified to lecture us all on. However I will continue to use that very phrase to point out your pomposity (oh look another word he has used before, oh I nearly forgot and Superiority) whenever you try getting above yourself. If you continue to lecture and harangue then I will always reply to you in kind, so get used to it, now how does that sound from someone who is insecure? I am quite secure in my ability to Admin this forum and to deal with the likes of you on a daily basis and then put you back in your box when required. 8)

I have another word to describe you and that is hypocrite. You have spent most of the last few days lecturing me and others on how judges are above reproach that their knowledge, impartiality and interpretation of the law is beyond question and I quote you:
“And they are our sole bastion between a dictatorship.....or anarchy.”
If you are so supportive of the neutrality and sagacity of these people then why are you so happy to live under such a regime in Egypt? A place where the judiciary is a tool of a military dictatorship, a judicial system that is probably one of the most corrupt in the whole world who will hand out justice to the oppressed masses in spades, especially if it is a hanging offence, which incidentally most crimes seem to be. A corrupt military who keep the poor down trodden and yet you try and extol the virtues of judges, but of course you only meant OUR judges because no doubt another of your many talents is judging the morality of judges. As I said a Hypocrite, not just another holiday maker who has little interest in all this, but someone who actively supports such a regime. In any event I have spent enough wasted time with you already, I will not be wasting anymore it is a futile exercise.
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Thu Sep 26, 2019 7:57 pm

“I have spent enough wasted time with you already, I will not be wasting anymore it is a futile exercise.”

Oh good....no more tiresome rants then. :up

How quick you are to turn a discussion encompassing fact/opinion into a tirade of personal abuse when your facts are shown to be erroneous or your opinion differs. A bit like the Commons.

BTW...I have never “lived” in Egypt in the sense you mean although I’m fortunate enough to be able to go there as often as I please.

Do keep up.....

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Fri Sep 27, 2019 10:08 am

Yada, yada, :a84: :a86:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Image

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:04 pm

Can’t seem to open the above images.

I’m devastated. :a84: :58: :58: :58:

newcastle
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7077
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:49 am
Has thanked: 2035 times
Been thanked: 5960 times
Egypt

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by newcastle » Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:16 pm

Newcastle as I cannot remove the links to other websites from your post it has been deleted. When you understand the forum rules and technology a bit better feel free to repost your video
Horus (Forum Admin)

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:49 pm

newcastle wrote:
Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:04 pm
Can’t seem to open the above images.

I’m devastated. :a84: :58: :58: :58:
You cant open the above images because they cannot be researched by using Wiki therefore that puts you at a severe disadvantage. You need a bit more intellect to figure it out, but perhaps someone will be kind enough to explain it to you, then you can give us all a lecture on the subject, you are obviously not as smart as you would have us all believe. 8)
Image

User avatar
Horus
Egyptian God
Egyptian God
Posts: 7931
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 3481 times
Been thanked: 2538 times
Gender:
United Kingdom

Re: I fought the Law ....and the Law won!!

Post by Horus » Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:58 pm

As this is just turning into a personal arguement between the two of us I am now locking this thread.
Image