Luxor4u

Judging by the positional explanation we have on here, it sounds more like the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, but the Coptic "Gate to Heaven" encroaches much further onto the actual Kebash Road. The Catholic Franciscan Church isn't in the way at all, so I'd be astonished if it was that. (But we are talking about Luxor here!)

"For anyone who stayed at the Etap Hotel, as you came out of the hotel, turn right along the Corniche, then first right off the Corniche, directly at the bottom of that street is/was St Mary Church."

In actual fact A-Four, that's the Evangelical Presbyterian place! Then, to the left of that there is the juice shop and the "Government" supermarket before you get to the Coptic Church, with the loud Mosque directly opposite.

Yes you are correct Teddyboy, thank you. I remember now because down the back street of St Mary Church, was a little shop run by a Coptic family that made keys for any make of lock. .

HEPZIBAH wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 7:48 am

Thank you.
The more I think about it the more I think it must be the Coptic church, but I'm interested to know the fact.

https://en.wataninet.com/coptic-affairs ... rch/23628/

Thanks to
Teddyboy for confirming my memory of the geographical locations of the three churches I mentioned.
(P.s. I never did find the Methodist Church. Do you know if it is still open? )

Newcastle for the news article.
I vaguely remember there being talk of 'partial' demolition - presumably the wall at that point - way back when the clearance took place close to the Emilio Hotel and the many houses and businesses in that area, at quite short notice. It's sad to think that lovely building is no longer there.

I wonder if the planned total demolition of the St. Maria Coptic Church was behind the allowing of the new Coptic Cathedral to be built, especially as it is so close to the where St. Maria stood.

I haven't heard of the new Coptic Church being referred to as a cathedral by any of my Coptic friends in Luxor, though it's certainly big enough, with a capacity of 3000 over three floors. (A bit of a change from the wriggly tin place that preceded it!) We were fortunate enough to have VIP seats about 2, or maybe three, metres away from Pope Shenouda when he came to consecrate the building. (What a lovely little fellow he was.) It was fascinating to witness a service so strange to us simple Protestant folk!
The Methodists were still meeting the last time we were past their little chapel, but that was 18 months or so ago. (We're sitting here, wishing our lives away till Barmy Boris announces, tomorrow, whether Egypt is coming off the red list!)
Tui have got flights from Newcastle to Hurghada, and Madame Teddyboy has the page open ready to click for our booking! We don't feel up to wrestling with Heathrow this time, but we also dread the journey across that awful desert which perhaps may be the better of the two evils!

newcastle, your picture looks like it was taken from the (now disappeared) cross over road from the Emilio to the old "Centralle", and that it's of the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, in the foreground, with the Coptic spires behind. Is that correct?

Teddyboy wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 8:31 pm I haven't heard of the new Coptic Church being referred to as a cathedral by any of my Coptic friends in Luxor, though it's certainly big enough, with a capacity of 3000 over three floors. (A bit of a change from the wriggly tin place that preceded it!) We were fortunate enough to have VIP seats about 2, or maybe three, metres away from Pope Shenouda when he came to consecrate the building. (What a lovely little fellow he was.) It was fascinating to witness a service so strange to us simple Protestant folk!
The Methodists were still meeting the last time we were past their little chapel, but that was 18 months or so ago. (We're sitting here, wishing our lives away till Barmy Boris announces, tomorrow, whether Egypt is coming off the red list!)
Tui have got flights from Newcastle to Hurghada, and Madame Teddyboy has the page open ready to click for our booking! We don't feel up to wrestling with Heathrow this time, but we also dread the journey across that awful desert which perhaps may be the better of the two evils!

I have always known the large Coptic Church that was built in relatively recent years to be called a cathedral, by Coptic friends and also by Muslim friends. When it was written about on these forums during the time of its construction and early years, I'm sure it was referred to as cathedral too.

Going to a Coptic service of worship is definitely different and an interesting experience for those of us from more non conformist backgrounds. I imagine the inaugral service was even more so. I remember my first visit to St. Marias well for many reasons, but it was the singing that stood out the most for me.

It's good to hear the Methodist church still seems to be active.

Hope you manage to return to your Luxor home soon. Personally, I wouldn't relish either route at the moment, but then I'm still very much in anti-covid hibernation mode still.

Teddyboy wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 8:37 pm newcastle, your picture looks like it was taken from the (now disappeared) cross over road from the Emilio to the old "Centralle", and that it's of the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, in the foreground, with the Coptic spires behind. Is that correct?

That’s my reading of it.

Incidentally, I’m returning to UK on 20th Sept....via 10 days in Cyprus. All bought and paid for....so , Sod’s law being operative, Egypt will probably leave the red zone on 1st October

Personally...i think it highly unlikely given the still low level of vaccination and the virtual absence of testing. But , you never know....particularly as the current government has as many opinions as they have ministers. And they don’t seem to sing from the same hymn sheet.

HEPZIBAH wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:53 am I have always known the large Coptic Church that was built in relatively recent years to be called a cathedral, by Coptic friends and also by Muslim friends. When it was written about on these forums during the time of its construction and early years, I'm sure it was referred to as cathedral too.

Throughout the whole period of this church/Cathedral's life long before even the first stone was laid there was controversy as to where did the money come from, who was its main contributor, how that person acquired such money etc. The planning application was very controversial, during construction came the so called revolution, and all the problems that brought.

During one of my last visits to Luxor there was serious trouble where many Coptic church's were either vandalised or destroyed in Upper Egypt. I believe it was Autumn 2013 when the Bishop of Luxor, Bishop Youhannes Zakaria Badir, was at home when terrorists tried to break into his home and kill him, plus a similar attack was made on the home of the Bishop of Assiut. Both survived.

This whole subject of this building is open to controversy in Egypt, and more so in Luxor, depending who you speak to, and I suppose will remain so.

"Throughout the whole period of this church/Cathedral's life long before even the first stone was laid there was controversy as to where did the money come from, who was its main contributor, how that person acquired such money etc. The planning application was very controversial, during construction came the so called revolution, and all the problems that brought."

That comes as somewhat of as a surprise, A-Four. Our Luxor home is about 300 metres from the new Church, and I've never heard of any controversy at all! Mind you, we just keep our heads down, or even buried in the ground like the ostriches! As for finance, I believe that Mr Mamdour Phillipe was the main local contributor and that most of the money came from America.

(I've heard that if a Muslim builds a Mosque, no matter for his sins here on earth, he then has a direct journey to Paradise. Perhaps Mr Phillipe has heard the same story, but for Christians and Churches?)

The only inkling of controversy I have heard Teddyboy is to the height of the domes and were they higher than Luxor Temple. Work continues on the cathedral, one day it will be completed like the avenue of the sphinx.

I hear they will be playing Aida at the opening with the Prat in the Hat being the tenor....

Teddyboy wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 2:45 pm As for finance, I believe that Mr Mamdour Phillipe was the main local contributor and that most of the money came from America.

I am not sure how long you have lived in Luxor Teddyboy, but let me try to take you back to around 1995 ish. Just up the road from what was the Mina Palace Hotel were two tourist shops that went by the name Phillipe's, a little further was Phillipe Hotel and also another shop further called Phillipe Jeweller's shop, perhaps they are still around today, I'm not sure. These places were all owned by old Mr Phillipe, his portrait was always hung in the jeweller's shop, but also let me add that all these places were not modern, especially the hotel.

It was said that old Mr Phillipe came into a small fortune, though if he had declared it, the government would have asked some very serious questions, and the chance of total confiscation. He always believed that Luxor should have its own Cathedral, but I do not think he ever envisaged a place like Sonesta St George.

You are correct that some of the money came from America, but the vast amount came from Mr Phillipe's estate on death. You mention above his son, we'll all I can say is ask your neighbours, those best would be in their late 60's, about dear old Mr Phillipe, you might discover a few surprises, but try not to write on here.

There has always been much speculation as to how old Mr Phillipe came across his fortune, like even today, some one even speculate on the height of a dome, when with common local knowledge, the whole thing is constructed in the highest part of the city, but others may speculate further on another more sensible question here,however,...........I could not possibly comment.