Flying visit.

[Major Thom]

Well that all went well, had 2-3 hours looking around the place 1 hour in Luxor and 2 on the West Bank. Nothing has changed and very little has improved. See there is graffiti already on the newly laid Cornishe in places. On the West Bank hardly any change, a few new huts built, piles of bricks around, still canals with rubbish in etc etc. To me the place looked very poor and run down. But I was interested to see the places I haunted. I was in one cafe and a couple of people I knew, kept looking across, but did not recognise me justmaybe thought "I have seen that face before" when I had finished my coffee I said goodbye to them by name, so that must have given them food for thought. I both enjoyed and didn't enjoy returning, however got what I wanted doing at the Courts, so pleased. I now have no need to even suffer from niggling thoughts now its all sorted and I have got copies of documents. I noticed there were still people hassling, must admit I had gotten out of that! One thing I absolutely hated. I used the words Busa al la Teezak a few times... I would have thought the Hotel at the back of Sinbads would have got further on but no! It was only a flying visit, and all in all enjoyed walking around, but would I want to live there again. I think you all know the answer to that. But I did have a lovely day there, the 6 hour wait in Cairo was a nightmare though. Next week back at the local hospital in Cyprus to continue with my treatment, they are absolutely red hot in Cyprus if they think you have a problem, but I would sooner it be that way.

[Angela]

" To me, the place looked poor."
Of course, it does. It's a developing country with 33% of the population living below the poverty line; the figure is over 50% in Upper Egypt. The threshold is $1.90 a day so if you earn more than that...you're doing well.
This isn't Greece or Cyprus but a country with very challenging social problems. I have no idea why you would expect anything more than what you saw. The country was poor when you moved here and it still remains poor.

[crewmeal]

See there is graffiti already on the newly laid Cornishe in places.

Judging by your remark you must think there is no other graffiti in the world.

To me the place looked very poor and run down.

Have you just paid a visit to pick holes? Your general comments are crass. What do you expect in a developing country with a pandemic? As Angela stated most are living below the poverty line and therefore are in a very bad way. There is no tourist industry, no one visiting, no income. You must live in Utopia where everything is perfect.

Not a helpful post.

[Teddyboy]

"Not a helpful post."

I think you've both missed MT's point. The post wasn't meant to be helpful or otherise, it was just his observations during a quick visit. I love Luxor, and want to return a ASAP, and would be there now, if it wasn't for the current restrictions and hospital/doctors appointments.
However, we surely cannot be blind to the situation? The poverty in Luxor and Egypt is no excuse for the likes of canals being clogged with rubbish. The truth of the matter is that there is no sense of pride in the place, and not the slightest effort amongst the general population to make it at all attractive to visitors, from whom the vast majority of Luxor residents derive their living, either directly or indirectly. And it's not just the usual idleness, it's inherent in their culture, which would need a sea change to alter.
(p.s. Has anyone news of Ahmed John, the East Bank Scouser? A pm answer would be welcome.)

[HEPZIBAH]

"Not a helpful post."

I think you've both missed MT's point. The post wasn't meant to be helpful or otherise, it was just his observations during a quick visit. I love Luxor, and want to return a ASAP, and would be there now, if it wasn't for the current restrictions and hospital/doctors appointments.
However, we surely cannot be blind to the situation? The poverty in Luxor and Egypt is no excuse for the likes of canals being clogged with rubbish. The truth of the matter is that there is no sense of pride in the place, and not the slightest effort amongst the general population to make it at all attractive to visitors, from whom the vast majority of Luxor residents derive their living, either directly or indirectly. And it's not just the usual idleness, it's inherent in their culture, which would need a sea change to alter.
(p.s. Has anyone news of Ahmed John, the East Bank Scouser? A pm answer would be welcome.)

Whilst I think there is room for disagreement over Major Thom's point (or otherwise), I do believe you have a point when it comes to the apparent Egyptian mentality when it comes to the disposal of rubbish etc. I have always found it very hard to deal with those who bragged about such a wonderful country, so full of history and beauty, and yet be able to throw their debris into the streets. On one occasion I witnessed someone throwing their cans and bottles over the wall of Habu Temple. Their excuse 'No one cares for Egyptians, only the temples. It will get cleared from there.'

[newcastle]

I think you've both missed MT's point. The post wasn't meant to be helpful or otherise, it was just his observations during a quick visit

The post was meant - as all MT’ posts have meant since his departure - as a hate-filled trashing of Luxor and its inhabitants. He lost both time ( in his twilight years), and money, when he lived here and needs to get over it. It still seems to be eating at him despite his new life in Cyprus. How sad.

Did we really need to know that he’d sworn crudely ( in his pigeon-Arabic) at locals ?

His comments hardly come as news or a surprise to followers of this forum, or @nyone who has visited Egypt/Luxor. Maybe he thinks he’s doing the world at large a fovour in deterring them visiting?

Who know. Who cares. It’s beyond tedious.

[Angela]

I totally agree that there is a huge problem with rubbish and the mentality needs to be improved.
Where we live there is no rubbish collection, we have to take our rubbish to a communal bin. If we didn't have our own transport, it would be a 15-minute walk away. When we get to the communal bin it is overflowing with rubbish piled up at the side. You can return a few days later and still find the same rubbish there because it hasn't been collected. So, yes, people's attitudes need to change. However, those in authority also need to do their part otherwise you can see how the 'who cares' attitude manifests. It needs a joined-up approach; a drive to change attitudes coupled with a concerted effort to increase refuse collection and street bins on the back streets that are emptied regularly.

[Chris]

I walked along the Corniche last night and did not see any graffiti. Maybe he means the lower Corniche?

[DJKeefy]

I watched a video last week of a supermarket (think it was Luxor) of them dumping trolly fulls of French products in the canal
Its not much of a loss to the French since the products would have been paid for.
They could have just donated the products to a charity or the poor

[newcastle]

I watched a video last week of a supermarket (think it was Luxor) of them dumping trolly fulls of French products in the canal
Its not much of a loss to the French since the products would have been paid for.
They could have just donated the products to a charity or the poor

At times, you can’t beat the Egyptians for mindless, self-harming behaviour.

There was much discussion locally in Hurghada, when I was there, about boycotting Carrefour

Despite the fact that most of the produce/other items sold in the store are Egyptian-made....as are the staff

[newcastle]

The truth of the matter is that there is no sense of pride in the place, and not the slightest effort amongst the general population to make it at all attractive to visitors, from whom the vast majority of Luxor residents derive their living, either directly or indirectly. And it's not just the usual idleness, it's inherent in their culture, which would need a sea change to alter.

Couldn’t agree more....which is why I rarely bother raising the negative issues of life in Egypt. To imagine you can effect any change is beyond delusional.

Egypt is a country In which you get what you see.....and the rate of change - if any - is glacial.

Those foreigners who live here, or visit regularly, consider the positives outweigh the negatives.They might wish certain things would change, and occasionally put pen to paper to gripe about these, but surely few, if any, imagine that what they say will have any effect.

There’s nothing wrong with getting something off your chest.....although constant repetition is subject to the Law of Diminishing Returns

[BENNU]

I watched a video last week of a supermarket (think it was Luxor) of them dumping trolly fulls of French products in the canal ...

There was much discussion locally in Hurghada, when I was there, about boycotting Carrefour

When there was a boycot of Danish products, unknown butter wrapped in cellophane suddenly appeared in the supermarkets.

[hatusu]

The "Egyptian" mentality is blamed and yet, its not the whole of Egypt. When I visited El Tod Temple (on the way to Esna), I was amazed at the cleanliness of this town, with large rubbish bins on every street (and NOT overflowing). I didnt see any rubbish lying around , and when inside the temple, we were pleasantly surprised after enjoying our picnic, to find the Temple Guardians bringing a small waste basket to take away our small amount of rubbish. If one Egyptian town can do it, why cant the others?

[Major Thom]

My post was not in anyway for or against, like I said it was a flying visit, like I said I enjoyed the walk around too, I was just observing in he 3.5 years I have been left not much has changed at all, be the Country being a develping Country or not. I have always known the cornishe has being the lower walkway, the one I always used to get to the ferry. Where I used to live is built up now, but I still noticed my villa stood out in the village. I would have liked to have stayed there for an evening but alas time was not on my side. I would have been overjoyed though to have seen progress on a much larger scale than what I saw. All in all though my few hours was enjoyable, its just that I am no longer in that way of living. With my health issues too, I don't think I would be feeling too confident of living there now. I was under the medical system there almost 2 years, and still they were baffled at my condition. It took the medical system here 3-4 months to conclude what was wrong with me, and now I am well on the way to 100% full recovery. But apart from what I had to do I did enjoy it, I had a lovely coffee in a coffee shop near Maccy D, overlooking the Luxor Temple sat on a balcony, in fact it was so good I enjoyed a further two...ha ha

[Dusak]

It really is good to see that your attitude and observations concerning Luxor and its wonderful people has not changed since your departure. Sometimes folk emigrate/escape from one shite hole only to realise there are other shite holes to end up in. Maybe the flying visit made the mistake of landing.

[Major Thom]

I would not have made the visit D, but it was required for me to sign legal forms, and get them stampec in the presence of a legal representative. It was interesting you seem to refer to Luxor being a *********, I never said that at all, many the times I have said on here my health had not been good, and I required the certainty of living in a place with better care. If you think were I am living now is a so called ********, then its obvious you have not visited. The people keep the place lovely, we have regular bin collections, road cleaning vehicles, and well cared for buildings. Ok some got to be derelict in the war, but people are buying them up cheap now and are renovating them up lovely and to tradition, especially inthe villages. I do agree there are rough places all over the World, we have been to some, moreso the Asian areas, but Cyprus is not one. We took time, asked questions etc well in advance to moving. I think the only thing with Luxor is lack of investment, lack of opportunities for people, and the absence of properly paid jobs for the people.

[carrie]

I make no apologies for saying I love living in Luxor.
It may be dirty in parts, it may be run down. The corniche looks lovely after the recent reno. How MT walked along the lower corniche I have no idea its all torn up at the moment. But has he said it was a flying visit perhaps he flew over.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion I know and perhaps we do get defensive about a place we love.
Having said that my one and last visit to Cyprus was the worst holiday of my life. I didn't like the place or the people and wouldn't live there for a kings ransom. Each to their own.
One question for MT how would the people of Cyprus react if you went about vulgarly swearing at them?

[newcastle]

I too love Egypt.....and would live there permanently if my health situation was different.

This doesn’t mean I’m blind to its faults, or not frustrated by many aspects of life there.....but these are outweighed by what I enjoy about the place.

I don’t dwell on, or post about, the negative aspects of life in Egypt as I see no likelihood of them changing in my lifetime nor, as a foreigner, do I have any right - or ability - to effect any change. Any rambling or rants by me about Egyptian politics, poverty, inequities, squalor etc etc would be so much hot air....which I neither have the wish to expel nor, I imagine, does anyone wish to hear ( MT to note!)

As for Cyprus....I’ve been there on holiday a couple of times. Enjoyable...but then I’m a Grecophile. I wouldn’t mind living there but it doesn’t offer sufficient attractions to uproot me from. the UK, given my personal circumstances .